Source https://lemmy.ca/comment/23480286
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Cowbee has some pretty bad takes
That’s their only takes.
“Imperialist EU”… Do they no longer understand the meaning of words?
France invaded Libya because they dared to kick out French Companies. They have threatened to invade Burkino Faso for doing the same. EU countries currently have more than two dozen colonial states under their thumb. The EU, and its constituent countries, are the reason Imperialism is around in the modern world. They cannot exist without the rape of the global south. If they were to give up their colonies, the EU would die overnight as the entire EU is in an incredibly large import deficit.
France invaded Libya because they dared to kick out French Companies
Hmm? When? Do you mean Opération Harmattan?
Also: what does that have to do with the subject? The EU doesn’t work like the US, there’s not singular body determining where a military operation will happen.
That’s why I said calling EU “imperialist” stems from ignorance about the EU.
Everything you’re talking about has literally nothing to do with the EU. Moreover: the EU has zero mechanisms to enforce “anti-imperialism” on France, Denmark, or any other country.
It’s a bit like if you said “the UN is imperialist because the USA attacked Iran”. Just makes no sense.
A collection of imperialist states that have decided to share the profits of imperialism, is, by most honest people’s definition, an imperialist state itself.
And of course the EU has mechanisms to enforce ‘anti-imperialism’ on its member states. It doesn’t accept states with slavery, it coordinates sanctions against states that invade other countries, it coordinates sanctions against states it believes are not democratic, it can punish its own members for violating EU law.
It’s just not against EU law or morals to own slave states, as long as you have one singular layer of obscurity.
The reason I brought up France, one of the most important members of the EU, one of its only nuclear shields against Russia or the US, one of the most economically contributory members; is because it’s the first one that came to mind — and also it’s really, really fucking bad when you criticize Russia for fucking anything when France has done worse in the last decade and a half and had zero consequences for its actions. Not a single EU member state protested against the France-led war on Libya which resulted in the violent death of a democratically elected leader and now a failed state full of warlords fighting over the remains while EU-backed and endorsed terror groups (Seriously look into Khalifa Haftar) funnel oil to Europe.
The EU is imperialist because the majority of the most contributory member states making it up are imperialist, and it does nothing about it. Because they’re the good imperialists, peacefully raping Africa and the global south.
A collection of imperialist states that have decided to share the profits of imperialism, is, by most honest people’s definition, an imperialist state itself.
Right. Therefore the UN is imperialist. The WHO is imperialist. Caritas is imperialist.
And of course the EU has mechanisms to enforce ‘anti-imperialism’ on its member states. It doesn’t accept states with slavery, it coordinates sanctions against states that invade other countries, it coordinates sanctions against states it believes are not democratic, it can punish its own members for violating EU law.
Which EU laws are being violated by France? Which member states are being invaded by France? What fundamental rules of democracy and the rule of law are being broken in France?
Yes, those are defensive mechanisms the EU has to keep peace among the member states and to support member states in case of an outside threat.
But the sanctions are not “the EU has enforced sanctions against X” - that’s what the media calls it, sure, but that’s not how the mechanism works at all. The EU creates a resolution, and members states are supposed to comply and include the resolution in their own laws. But there aren’t any enforcement tools for the EU to actually make them - case in point, Orban’s Hungary ignored the sanctions against russia and continued to trade with them. The only thing the EU was able to do was withholding money from them.
Not a single EU member state protested against the France-led war on Libya which resulted in the violent death of a democratically elected leader and now a failed state full of warlords fighting over the remains while EU-backed and endorsed terror groups (Seriously look into Khalifa Haftar) funnel oil to Europe.
OK, two things to unpack here.
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Khalifa Haftar? So you ARE talking about Opération Harmattan! How in the world is that in any way “EU imperialism”, mate? The 2011 intervention was the UN not EU. Here’s a wiki article about the resolution. 0 members (with famously “imperialist” countries such as Nigeria, Gabon, Colombia, and Bosnia-Herzegovina) voted against. AND it was aimed at Gaddafi’s forces, so no idea about what “violent death of a democratically elected leader” are you talking about.
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The EU mostly financially supports the Libyan coast guard, in hopes that it will stem the flow if migrants. Hardly a “terror group”.
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Still not sure if the tankies actually believe their own nonsense, or if it’s some 4chan-esque facade that Trumpers get a kick out of posting under some insufferable ‘blue MAGA’ persona.
I mean, they’re Trumpers either way, but do they actually realize that?
probably drank the same koolaid as magats would. they even use the same PC buzzwords.
I’d say the split is around 50/50.
Some truly believe this crap, and the rest are LARPing MAGAts
Tankies are tribal loyalists whose chosen ingroup is leftists and alleged leftists. They do not understand the latter distinction. Like all conservatives, their stated ideals are ad-hoc justifications. Claims cannot contradict, in this worldview, because claims are not evaluated; they are only a card-shuffling word game to establish superiority.
They think that’s all you’re doing. They think that’s all there is.
I don’t know, but we need to make a distinction between their users which are generally really cool, and the leadership which is a bunch of boot lickers to Russia and China.
While definitely more exaggerated in the leadership, it’s definitely the users too. Not every .ml is a trumper, but a huge portion of the trumpers I’ve run into here are .ml …I’m guessing the divide is in large part due to the process of picking your first instance - a lot of us just threw a dart at a map of the fediverse and settled where it landed, cuz getting started here when all you’ve messed with previously are sites like Reddit is a major pain in the ass. So, some of them are sincerely decent, they just wandered into a bad neighborhood.
There is a base that is really not more insane than any other base necessarily.
I bet half if not more of this group believes that if we only believed in Kamala harder she would have won , it’s not the fault of the democratic party and Kamala harris, it’s the fault of the voters for not believing her enough.
Truth be it was a lost cause from the minute they anointed her, which I called by the way.
Which is all to say otherwise good people can be quite mistaken, and the majority of the users of that ml are cool from what I have experienced.
from the minute they anointed her
She was gaining steam. Idk if enough to actually win without any other hitches, but there were hitches, so who fuckin knows. I was hopeful up until that interview where they asked her about Isreal’s genocide on Gaza, and he response was something to the effect of “we’ll do everything in our power to uphold the security of Isreal” aka US bombs will continue to fall on Gaza.
Even that was still better than Trump, but she lost an insane amount of single issue voters with one breath; meanwhile the Trumpers were cheering for genocide from day 1, so when the blue team gets to choose between more vs less genocide which understandably burns them out; and the red team gets to choose more vs less genocide and can’t push through the corpses of brown children fast enough to hit that ‘more’ button… yeah, we were fucked from that moment on.
…not to say the anointment was a good move. The DNC fucked us again.
Point being that fault doesn’t fall on any one group. Would-be blue voters fucked us by not showing up, the DNC fucked us by propping up a walking corpse through an entire presidency, Harris fucked us by overtly supporting genocide, red voters fucked us for choosing the greater evil, and Trump fucked us like one of his 14 year olds on Epstein’s island by being the serial worst-case-scenario every fucking time.
Collectively, the US failed about as miserably as it possibly could from every single angle.
I mean, not all users on Lemmy.ml are horrible people, but conversely after discounting hexbear.net and lemmygrad.ml, the most batshit insane comments left that I would see inevitably came from Lemmy.ml.
I do not regret blocking the entire instance. Maybe some innocent people get excluded that way, but that’s a price I am absolutely willing to pay to avoid the insanity. And it’s not like the opinions about ML are not widely known - someone who remains on that instance despite all that goes on there surely knows that being blocked is likely a possibility, so I don’t let their recalcitrance get in the way of me enjoying my time on the Threadiverse.
.ml
The AIDS of Lemmy.
Ironically, ML’s global rule 1 references its code of conduct, which says
Respect that people have differences of opinion and that every design or implementation choice carries a trade-off and numerous costs. There is seldom a right answer.
This is how all “free speech” absolutists behave.
Their idea of compromise is when the other side does what they say.
Respect is not a virtue for extremists / zeolotes.
It’s called hypocrisy
well thats alarming.
Soon this will be re🅱️🅱️it 2.0.
Except Reddit grants far more rights to individual users who are not instance admins than Lemmy does.
Reddit offers: notifications for when your content gets removed, modmail to ask questions why, Reddit admin appeal if that fails, the ability to continue commenting for months on content after it gets removed from the community feed (accessible to anyone at all with the URL, even if they were not part of the OG conversation), etc. PieFed has some of this too btw.
Whereas Lemmy is even more authoritarian minded than Reddit is! Again, not to instance owners, but to individual users. We even have our own fully automated moderation bots (e.g. look up santabot).
Lemmy.ml in particular already is leftist Reddit 2.0. Except without “advanced features” like polls, user and post flairs, multi-communities, and so on (PieFed has all of these btw).
Always has been meme.
That’s why I blocked lemmy.ml a long time ago.
I went a step further and stopped using their software (lemmy/jerboa). #piefedgang
Side note, not sure if lemmy does this yet, but piefed merges comments from crossposts so you can view it all on the same page. super convenient.
Yeah and nothing of worth was lost by doing it. I highly recommend everyone do so.
Except that no new user is told this upon signing up to any current instances that I am aware of, and especially someone browsing anonymously without an account will not be aware.
This is why we are a Tankie bar - we platform them, thus people conflate us together as if we ARE them, and nope right out and never come back.
Perhaps to be “fair and balanced”, we should let in the Maga base actual Nazis a seat at the table too?
Jill Stein is a sellout traitor too.
Fuck tankies and their delusions.
a sellout traitor
What on earth do you think a distant fourth place contender sold, exactly? What do you think she got in exchange, even?
There is exactly one person who was a close friend of Donald Trump, who convinced him to run in the primary, who supported him financially and encouraged suffocating media coverage, and who ultimately propelled him into the general election.
So to take Bush down, Clinton’s team drew up a plan to pump Trump up. Shortly after her kickoff, top aides organized a strategy call, whose agenda included a memo to the Democratic National Committee: “This memo is intended to outline the strategy and goals a potential Hillary Clinton presidential campaign would have regarding the 2016 Republican presidential field,” it read.
“The variety of candidates is a positive here, and many of the lesser known can serve as a cudgel to move the more established candidates further to the right. In this scenario, we don’t want to marginalize the more extreme candidates, but make them more ‘Pied Piper’ candidates who actually represent the mainstream of the Republican Party,” read the memo.
“Pied Piper candidates include, but aren’t limited to:
• Ted Cruz
• Donald Trump
• Ben Carson
We need to be elevating the Pied Piper candidates so that they are leaders of the pack and tell the press to [take] them seriously."
This is the woman all you liberal dipshots were ride-or-die for ten years ago. She single-handled elevated her CLOSE PERSONAL FRIEND, Donald Trump, to the GOP nomination and then to the Presidency.
What does this have to do with the traitorous Jill Stein?
A scapegoat is an innocent individual or group unfairly blamed for the mistakes, failures, or wrongdoings of others. People or institutions use scapegoating to deflect responsibility, manage public anger, or protect those actually at fault.
I’m sorry. Are we living in the dimension where someone can’t hate Clinton AND Stein? Or just hate Stein without hating Clinton?
Stein is a dumbfuck that magically appears right before an election, has absolutely no chance of winning, siphons votes, then magically disappears again after the election. She has no purpose other than to siphon votes. You think she’s just doing that for funsies?
She’s fucking scum.
If you think someone else is scum…neat. Thanks for sharing. Literally no one brought up Hillary Clinton. She’s just on your brain. Some would call it Hillary Derangement Syndrome.
She’s fucking scum.
I’m still waiting to hear what, exactly, Stein did other than sit at a table with Putin and Michael Flynn (an Obama Era general who never gets mentioned when this photo is discussed) in 2015.
She wasn’t QAnon. She didn’t raise any appreciable amount of money that year. She failed to mobilize anything close to Nader’s following in 2000.
Literally what did she do?
If you think someone else is scum…
I think Hilary Clinton actively promoted one of her NYCeha-donor friends to hijack the GOP primary.
That’s not “scum”. That’s “spending millions of dollars and thousands of man hours to shape the results of the election”.
You seem to hate Stein because she exists.
Is lemmy the new reddit?
No, because you can keep using it if you disagree with its creators by simply using a different instance, unlike if you disagree with Spez on Reddit.
You mean Spez, the former mod of r/jailbait/, right?
He was added as a mod as a joke (mods can mod anyone without their having a say in it). The guy is cunt enough without misinformation though this one’s been doing the rounds a long time.
I helped moderate a couple of mid-sized communities and users had to actively accept moderation appointment, but maybe that was only true after a certain date?
Nah. Lemmy doesn’t bot ban me for discussing my Constitutional rights and speaking ill of fascists.
I mean… look up santabot, we literally do have such bots here (although Lemmy does not notify you when you get banned from somewhere, so it’s entirely possible that maybe you’ve been banned numerous times but simply don’t know it? :-P), plus Lemmy.ml is extremely well-known for doing exactly this though?
It is far less common here though, yes. Probably bc we are smaller.
I mean… look up santabot
Thankfully that bot and the user who created the bot are no longer on Lemmy. That thing sucked ass, and the user who created it was a jerk too.
Well I have to admit, it is somewhat demeaning to Russians.
It’s a running joke in American politics for Democrats to shit the bed in a dozen winnable states, then spend the next four years insisting “The tiny fringe third party candidate stabbed us in the back!” This, while cozying up to the most toxic reactionaries the US has to offer.
You can do a national tour with Liz Cheney and Jeff Flake for the last three months of your campaign. You can spend half a billion dollars on that weird Las Vegas globe thing, running annoying ads that only other DC consultants pay attention to. You can mirror Republican policy on issues Americans absolutely hate. And you can bend over backwards for the most horrid stew of reactionary oligarchs.
But it’s still always those damned foreigners, those stupid independent voters, and the insidious Internet Leftists who are to blame when you lose.
I told him you were a dick. No problem.
I’ll be honest; This looks petty, and I dont see the point of putting so much energy into this.
Documentation of authoritarians authoritarianism and the ideologies they cultivate/promote/push is always a worthwhile endeavor
.ml likes to operate with subtlety to push their brand of authoritarianism and support for Russia or NK or China. Hex and grad?..not so much. So I document their subtlety. Hopefully at the very least, it shows newcomers that there is a large pushback against their crap and the Threadiverse isn’t the left-wing version of Voat.
It’s kinda is though. I mean, if you block half the Threadiverse then it becomes halfway usable but until then… I’ve stopped recommending to people irl. The number of outright dirty looks that people have given me after doing a Google search (we are talking mainstream non-technical normal folks here alright!?!) and finding as the top instance hit Lemmy.ml (nowadays it points to lemmy.world but a couple years ago it was ML), which remember shows only Local content rather than All, to someone without an account… was simply too damn high!
You actually recommended it to people you know irl? I’ve never been able to feel comfortable enough to do that lol
Yes, I did once. I am glad that I did not get fired for doing so, though I wonder if even checking PieFed or Lemmy alone might in some hypothetical future scenario get me noticed by certain federal agencies who may not be precise in their determinations as to who is an agitator vs. who is merely using the ActivityPub Protocol independently. That is just one of the many problems with is being a tankie bar - all it would take would be like an assassination attempt by someone with prominent ties to Lemmy and suddenly we all of us will be under much tighter scrutiny.
But back in the day, in the year following the Rexodus, I did have more hopes for the future of the Threadiverse. I was more naive then and did not realize many things that I do now. Such as the fact that tankies legitimately want to overthrow all Western civilizations, e.g. by pushing the false bOtH sIdEs SaMe rhetoric just before any major election in prominent Western nations. Literally millions and in all likelihood fully over a billion people are going to die in the next twenty to fifty years as a result of climate change alone, not to mention all the direct deaths from the wars, much even though obviously not all of which are indirectly consequential to their actions.
So no, I do not recommend it to anyone irl or otherwise anymore.
