TLDR:
Windows 11 v24H2 and beyond will have Recall installed on every system. Attempting to remove Recall will now break some file explorer features such as tabs.
YT Video (5min)
For years… well pretty much since I had a PC, I had a Windows partition. Why? Well because I (sadly) paid for the damn thing (damn OEM deals). Plus, I admit, sometimes they were things that only ran on Windows.
For few years now though, everything, literally, from the latest tech gadget to playing games to VR, works on Linux.
Few weeks ago I deleted the Windows partition. I didn’t have to. I didn’t boot on it for months. It didn’t affect me.
Still, I now feel … safer, more relaxed, coherent.
When I see shit like that, I feel even better!
VR works on Linux? Thru Steamvr?
Depends on the headset, they don’t all work on Linux unfortunately.
It was mostly working 2 years ago when I tried it last. I just had some weird frame dropping issues at the time that I can only imagine were fixed by now. This post is making me want to try VR again on my linux install
SteamVR and ALVR are the only ones that I’ve gotten to work, no dice on standalone DCS though which was the whole reason I bought the damn headset a couple years ago
So… how does this exist in corporate environments where PCI DSS is necessary? Is the government also going to have to deal with fallout from this?
I wonder if there will ever be a point where legislation dictates features from an os vendor… we lost control of our hardware when they started forcing updates. I’m sure someone will hack a DLL or something to allow explorer to run but kill this component… But should we really need to hack our systems to protect ourselves from spying?
Inb4 Linux - I ran Slackware in the early 90s, and my server still runs a deb based distro… but when I want to play Forza, I’m pretty limited with my choices, etc.
I’ve been wondering this too. Will there be a way for company policy admins to somehow remove this fully? I work in an industry that deals with very sensitive and private information - no way in hell this would ever even remotely be allowed or pass any audits. Even just existing but being disabled could be problematic.
But big companies aside, how will this impact small companies who have no real in house IT? The potential for it to be capturing and storing stuff like, as you say anything required by PCI compliance, could turn into a nightmare. We also know this will inevitably be hacked or used by spyware somehow, someday, too no matter how secure they say it may be. So now a bad actor can recall an entire day work and data capture from a worker?
So, I just bought a new laptop. It came with Windows 11. But anyways, I’m writing this comment from a freshly installed Bazzite Linux OS.
/s just in caseAhahaha, holly fucking shit.
They literally added some OS in their spyware.
So, iirc, recall was a copilot+ PC “feature”. Will this recall integration be the case on “normal” x86 PCs as well?
I moved all my personal stuff over to linux
Windowsabout a year and a half ago. Unfortunately, there’s still a few things in my life that requires windows…Edit: I can’t type, apparently
Glad I moved away from Windows on all my personal computers. Fedora with Plasma is so similar to Windows and so much better. If my non-tech partner can use it, then anyone can.
Only problem is that Windows is better at resizing content on high resolution (4K) monitors. And ordering multiple monitors on the login screen doesn’t always work right, but it’s fine once logged in. And it takes a bit more to set up than preinstalled Windows that’s on most computers when you buy them. But if it was preinstalled and set up already for the hardware like Windows usually is, it would be way better for nearly everyone.
I’m not sure how it works for KDE and sddm but on gdm it is possible to copy the monitors.xml config file to a certain directory to fix that. After doing so, the login and lock screen settings are synced between the desktop environment and display manager. Not sure how to do it for sddm but I’m sure there’s a way, maybe a script with the correct xrandr commands could solve that.
Edit: monitors.xml, not x11.conf
Yeah, that works sometimes, but the way to fix it seems to change every time I have had to do it. And I have been using Wayland lately and haven’t found a good way to do it that works with the latest versions.
Judging by the comments in this thread this will be the one defining mistake that kills Microsoft.
I hope every SWE looks at this and remembers how not to conduct oneself.
I doubt it’s the engineers who are demanding that this atrocity exist.
The issue is that people who find an issue with it and don’t want to do it will get told off by management. Then management just replaces them with someone who is willing to do it (for job safety, or simply because they don’t care)
Thats just how big tech is
There’s some moral responsibility though. When it comes to privacy though, the majority is too naive
And it’s why I, as a self-respecting SWE, refuse to apply to big tech jobs. Yeah, I could get paid a lot more, but it’s not worth it for the work culture. My current org seems to respect my opinions and values, and that’s worth a lot more than money.
Microsoft has been the single most effective marketing asset for GNU/Linux distributions in recent years.
Tbf in recent decades.
Even tho googled-android should have been even more so, but the hardware licence fuchshittery is a huge obstacle.
So true. I got fed up with all this Recall and AI BS and recently replaced Win 11 (which I upgraded to by accident) with PopOS. No issues so far and PopOS is much faster than Windows.
PC gamer for a lot of my life. My old Win8.1 system is slowly dieing and I can play less and less games…win 11 has made me decide to leave the hobby. I may grab a Steamdeck, but I think I am done with PC gaming (and consoles are just shit PCs now). I have a Linux work PC, but I am not bothering with making a gaming Linux rig when I can just go the Steamdeck route.
Just popping in to mention that Bazzite can be put on your win8 machine and it will prob run games better than win does. in case you don’t know, Bazzite is installable on PC’s where steamOS isn’t yet and it’s as close to SteamOS as they can get.
I have a SD docked and plugged into a TV with a controller at home. It works great, I swore off Win PC’s about when win8 came out, so I haven’t used it in a long time except for work, and every day I’m glad I upgraded to Linux.
Steam Deck is great, 10/10, would recommend, but you could also just load Linux on your old system and keep using it.
I can better justify taking the out presented and using the Steamdeck for my fix. It will be cathartic lol
Well Valve was doing too well with the steam deck in that area so they had to trump them, second place is just the first loser.
Valve is holding the carrot, Microsoft the stick.
Not effective enough, it seems.
absolutely. I had tried Linux on various machines long ago but was one of the people that was put off by older distro’s learning curves - I’m now daily driving Linux on both my laptop and desktop and the main push for the switch is microsoft fucking around with settings, installing candy crush after updates (on a paid OS), adding more and more dumb, unsolicited, privacy invading AI bullshit with every feature update, and running like shit on a perfectly adequate machine.
Modern Linux, with flatpak support? I haven’t looked back once - had to help a friend fix something on a win11 desktop recently and was reminded of every reason I made the switch. Even if I had to jump in the terminal every day like long ago, it would still be worth it to not have bing, copilot, and edge rammed down my throat, whether I want them or not.
Windows is getting so shitty that completely non-technical users are tired of it… as soon as somewhat open minded users start to experiment and realise that Linux feature and UX parity has been achieved - I hope microsoft fucking collapses and we can all finally walk into the sunlight that open source OSes and software represent.
I love winutil. Makes debloating windows a lot easier.
Does it remove recall?
Installs Debian.
The freaking out over an optional feature that you need specific hardware for anyway is unreal.
If Fedora had announced this as a feature you’d have wanked yourselves into a coma.
If it’s an explorer.exe dependency, it’s not an optional feature.
Eh? What’s this bold assumption that people would like this “feature” if fedora introduced it?
it was vastly easier to install linux mint than it is to figure out registry editing or whatever the fuck i’d need to avoid this
This is where some Windows shill says “you only need to fix it once!” as if this is your only computer ever, and the only problem you need to fix. And then Windows changes it back to their default in next year’s update.
And as if it’s entirely reasonable for the maker of your OS to intentionally work against your ability to control your own hardware and what runs on it.
The difference between Linux and Windows is on Linux you’re working with the operating system to make modifications and taking advantage of its vast resources (extensive wikis on major distos, terminal auto completion with fish and zsh, preconfigured defaults when installing through the package manager, etc). Meanwhile on Windows you’re actively working against the system in order to disable unwanted features like AI and telemetry.
(Also I would recommend looking into Debian, the software may be a tad bit old but its the most stable distribution)
Happy Debian daily driver here. I would never ever recommend raw Debian to a garden variety would-be Linux convert.
If you think something like Debian is something a Linux illiterate can just pick up and start using proficiently, you’re severely out of touch with how most computer users actually think about their machines. If you even so much as know the name of your file explorer program, you’re in a completely different league.
Debian prides itself on being a lean, no bloat, and stable environment made only of truly free software (with the ability to opt-in to nonfree software). To people like us, that’s a clean, blank canvas on a rock-solid, reliable foundation that won’t enshittify. But to most people, it’s an austere, outdated, and unfashionable wasteland full of flaky, ugly tooling.
Debian can be polished to any standard one likes, but you’re expected to do it yourself. Most people just aren’t in the game to play it like that. Debian saddles questions of choice almost no one is asking, or frankly, even knew was a question that was ask*-able*. Mandatory customizeability is a flaw, not a feature.
I am absolutely team “just steer them to Mint”. All the goodness of Debian snuck into their OS like medicine in a kid’s dessert, wrapped up in something they might actually find palatable. Debian itself can be saved for when, or shall I say if, the user eventually goes poking under the hood to discover how the machine actually ticks.
Debian is probably one of the worst choices for someone looking to try Linux, especially for gaming.
Nothing better than setting everything up only to find you can’t install some new thing because your xyz is too old
Debian is always my first choice, but I’m not playing the newest stuff (Far Cry 5/7D2D/Ark/etc), while it hasn’t been ‘smooth sailing’, I haven’t found anything that just refuses to play.
I was on Debian Sid for a year or 2 and gaming was working perfectly until I did an update that uninstalled my GUI and WiFi drivers. I’m on Mint now and it’s been smooth sailing so far
Anyone whos new to gaming on Linux is probably using the Steam Flatpak, also stability is more important for newer users then a few utilities that power users (like myself) enjoy.
Debian just looking out for their users making sure they don’t waste time playing vidya.
I absolutely love Linux mint. I use it daily for dev work, but I’d also install it on my mother’s old laptop so she could keep using Facebook on it or whatever.
I’ve been very impressed by the out-of-the-box experience with Pop!_OS. My Steam games work, and I have Elder Scrolls Online running through Lutris.
So far, everything just works.
I have to admit that one does look really good too.
I have a couple of old windows machines at home, so eventually (maybe as a winter project) I’ll need to decide if I want to try some other distros long term.
Same. First distro that was actually painless 10 years ago, and I haven’t looked back.
Nah, mate, Linux is hard, you need to know what a Wayland is. In comparison, Windows is very simple and lightweight, you only have to run a dozen Powershell scripts and edit the registry weekly to get rid of ads.
“Do I look like I know what a Wayland is?”
I just want a picture of a goddamn hotdog
You sonova… Have an upvote
Had me in the first half, not gonna lie… “Windows is very simple and lightweight” 😂
And some Windows update would “accidentally” undo that anyways.
Welcome to Linux Mint mate!
Maybe Cinnamon mate!
I thought Cinnamon and Mate were different things… /s
For the people who doesn’t get it (I notice your /s, so you do get it): It’s has a hidden joke. Mate can also mean “friend”. So “Welcome to Linux Mint mate!” can mean two things at the same time. Hence my reply: “Maybe Cinnamon mate!”, where “Cinnamon” refers to “Linux Mint Cinnamon”, but mate just refers to friend/buddy. But Mate can also mean MATE, a classic desktop environment for Linux Mint.
Oh haha, didn’t realise that pun was intended… But yeah thats right :)
yes thank you!
I’m thinking of changing my life (to require less of rot-affected computing) and moving to FreeBSD. Even Linux is hard in small ways, even if worlds easier than Windows. Would be OpenBSD if not for games.
Mate you think BSD is better than Linux for ease-of-configuration – in what fucking universe?!
I dunno
in what fucking universe
“BSD” is one thing, so can’t answer your question.
If you meant that Linux has a lot of graphical configurators to do things - GUI is not necessarily easier than editing config files, because config files can be clean and compact and examples well-commented, and documentation can actually describe how to use the bloody thing. It’s just that in Linux this is not the case. While GUI configurators can be hardly usable nonsense and yes, in Linux they mostly are.
And this difference in wide strokes is indeed common for all 4 BSDs against Linux for things that differ between operating systems.
The rest sucks just as badly.
how the fuck could they have possibly done things in a way that makes explorer tabs depend on recall?
if they can’t even separate out recall from the rest of the operating system then i have absolutely no faith it will be secure.
how the fuck could they have possibly done things in a way that makes explorer tabs depend on recall?
It’s very clearly an intentional move to keep it installed.
It’s so you can’t rip Recall out without ruining Explorer, and possibly other things
Internet explorer did similar things, try to remove it and the OS would just crash.
Edit: just remembered it also had direct memory access to make it faster (well, less slow) which was so insanely unsecure on so many levels.
A browser, which is like the prime attack vector for malware and other nasty stuff, having direct memory access is so hilarious in hindsight
These days you try to sandbox everything as much as possible in the browser since the internet is like the least trusted environment there is
Except the OS in this case lol
Linux is here to welcome you
Man, I cling to Windows like nobody else, as I didn’t have any advertising issues and such, but this will be the final straw.
It’s already enough of a spying system but I refuse to have it as a spy on crack.
Time to read into distros.
There’s plenty to read up on but I think starting with any is a good place. You’ll find stuff you dislike. I’d recommend setting up ventoy on a USB (it will let you have several linux images on one thumb drive) and testing out most importantly the desktop environment (DE).
Main ones being KDE, GNOME, and cinnamon that comes with Mint (which is a great first distro to test).
If you end up having questions feel free to DM me
As far as Linux distros are concerned, really, any distro is just a package manager with repos and a set of default utilities. Essentially, a distro is an opinion on how you should use your system, not a law. Now prepare for my ADHD-fuelled stream of consciousness (which I wrote instead of getting any work done, yay):
Stay away from Arch and Gentoo for your first distro. These are basically meme distros, especially Gentoo. They allow for a lot of flexibility and building a really minimal install, but come with install-time complexity you really don’t need. Try them later on if you’re interested. Stay away from nixOS for now too, although it’s also awesome.
Package managers
Essentially, you have two main packaging types: RPM (used by Fedora/RedHat’s dnf, previously yum and (Open)SuSE’s zypper) and deb (used by apt mostly, dunno if others).
Either one is fine, but I think you’ll probably find more software available as debs. But the difference barely exists and with GUI apps you can usually install a flatpak anyway (more on this later).
Deb
Everything deb/apt comes from the Debian lineage.
You have Debian, the granddaddy of stability, releases come every few years and are tested thoroughly. After package freeze, only bugfixes and security updates usually get added. Then you have Ubuntu, a fork of Debian with more frequent releases as well as Long-Term Support releases every 2 years. Ubuntu used to be the most recommended beginner distro, but it’s no longer the case - not just because it has ads in it, but also because it pushes Snaps over Flatpaks AND occasionally tries to force Snaps over regular packages (again, more on this later).
Then, much like Ubuntu has forked Debian, others have forked Ubuntu. There’s Linux Mint - used to have the same release cadence as Ubuntu, but now they only base their releases off Ubuntu LTS versions. Really, it’s Ubuntu without all the commercial stuff Ubuntu’s been pushing. And they maintain their own desktop environment(s), but you can get those elsewhere too. There’s also Pop!_OS which is developed by System76, a laptop manufacturer. It used to come with its’ own customizations on top of Gnome, but now they’re creating their own desktop environment altogether, which is currently in Alpha 2. And then there’s KDE Neon, which is also based on Ubuntu LTS, but it ships the latest version of KDE Plasma desktop environment, rather than whatever version is in the latest Ubuntu LTS.
Rpm
On the rpm side, you mostly have two families for non-enterprise users: Fedora, which has a similar release cadence to Ubuntu, but apparently keeps packages more up to date between releases and OpenSuSE, which has Leap (new versions every year, with critical bugfixes and security updates in the meantime) and Tumbleweed, which is rolling release, so you just get the latest version of every package that has been tested, rather than having to wait for a new release. Tumbleweed gets updated just about every day. There’s also Slowroll, which gets big updates monthly, but can still get bugfixes between those.
Desktop Environments
For just about any distro, you can get just about any desktop environment. Ubuntu and Fedora default to Gnome. KDE Neon is pretty much just meant to be used with KDE Plasma. Pop!_OS defaults to customized Gnome unless you get the alpha version of the new COSMIC desktop. OpenSUSE defaults to KDE Plasma.
For Ubuntu you get variants like Kubuntu, Xubuntu, Lubuntu, etc, for whatever desktop you want, or you can switch alter (
apt install kubuntu-desktopfor an example). For Fedora, you can get a Fedora Spin, like Fedora KDE Spin for an example. Or you can similarly switch:dnf install @kde-desktop-environment. Same goes for all of them, really.Desktop environments: The two big ones are KDE Plasma (close to Windows in default appearance, but a lot more customizable, and more functional straight out of the box) and Gnome, which as of Gnome 3 is just… unique, I guess. It’s different. Then on the “Help I’m running this on a computer from 2004” side you have things like XFCE and LXQT. (Xubuntu, Lubuntu get their names from these). Those work just fine too, just a bit less eye candy. There are a lot more of less mainstream ones like Budgie or Enlightenment, but you can worry about those later.
Sandboxed applications - Flatpak, Snap
Now, why did I mention Flatpaks and Snaps earlier? Those are sandboxed package managers. A package comes with a sandbox of its’ own, and Flatpak or Snap keeps a copy of all the libraries it depends on, instead of using system libraries. This means that 1) There’s never a version conflict between what’s installed on your system and what the application uses and 2) You have multiple copies of some libraries (Flatpak and Snap both I think do try to deduplicate though so if two applications use the same version of a dependency, it keeps one copy stored). 3) You can install applications your distro doesn’t even have a package for.
Both also keep system resources out of reach of the applications, so they’re more secure to some degree if you don’t trust an application. This comes with limitations, too - sometimes you NEED your application to have access to something that’s limited in Flatpak or Snap. You can sorta fix this with flatseal for Flatpak, but it’s not perfect.
The real problem with Snap, besides having a proprietary backend vs Flatpak where you can use either Flathub or another application store with it, is that Ubuntu is starting to force it upon you - including for applications you may not want to run in a sandbox at all. You’ll run
apt install firefoxand it’ll play a trick on you and install the Snap instead of the deb. You lose some control over your system and how you use it. You can override this, but it’s possibly more work than you’d want to take on as a brand new Linux user.At the end of the day, I recommend using either OpenSuSE Tumbleweed (if you want latest and greatest always), Fedora, Linux Mint, or Pop!_OS. If you really want the latest and greatest KDE Plasma and don’t want Tumbleweed, then KDE Neon might make sense for you.
OpenSuSE
As an openSUSE user, I want to also point out that you can upgrade from Leap -> Tumbleweed really easily, so I highly recommend starting with Leap and upgrading to Tumbleweed later once you get a feel for the system and want something a little more exciting and up-to-date.
That said, I don’t recommend openSUSE for a new user unless you’re in Europe, because there just isn’t a huge userbase or single community I can point at. Support is high quality, when you can find it, but quite a bit less plentiful vs Fedora. That said, SUSE is huge in Europe, so you could probably find a lot more non-English language support.
So if you’re sold on an RPM distro, I recommend Fedora, not because openSUSE is bad, but purely based on community support. That said, my primary recommendation is Linux Mint due to community size and proximity to Debian (which also has a huge community).
OpenSUSE defaults to KDE Plasma.
That’s not really true, it asks you in the installer which one you want. However, most openSUSE users seem to recommend KDE, so you’ll probably get the best help with that desktop (and it’s what I use, now that Wayland support is pretty good).
At the end of the day, I recommend
I differ a bit. Here’s what I recommend:
- Linux Mint
- Fedora
- Debian
- openSUSE Leap -> Tumbleweed (start w/ Leap, upgrade to Tumbleweed later)
- Pop!_OS
I use openSUSE, but put it lower due to limited community support. It’s the perfect distro for me, and I love the different spins it has. I currently use Leap for servers and Tumbleweed for desktop/laptop, and I plan to transition to microOS for servers.
Arch
I don’t see Arch as a meme, I think it’s a fine distro and I used it for several years. However, I don’t think it should be anyone’s first distro, or even second, not because it’s hard or complicated (it’s remarkably simple), but because it doesn’t really have any guardrails, so whether you have a good or bad experience with it depends more on you than the distro itself.
That said, don’t use Manjaro, it’s not “easier Arch” or “safer Arch,” in fact I think it has way more problems than Arch does. If you want an easy install option, I recommend using something else first. If you are familiar with Arch, then use something like EndeavorOS so you don’t need to do all the setup, but as a first time user, I recommend using Arch’s official install process instead.
Calling Arch a meme distro is unnecessarily insulting. I imagine the same applies to Gentoo, but I haven’t used it myself. It’s an enthusiast distro, for people who want to have control over how their system is set up while accepting the responsibility of having to set everything up.
I absolutely agree with recommending against it for somebody’s first experience - but if you’re willing to read through the guides and troubleshoot issues, you can learn a lot about how things work on Linux. It’s the kind of distro where you will have issues, and they will usually be due to your own mistakes.
I categorized them as meme distros because you’re going to spend more time getting things just right than actually using your computer, at least for a while. In fact you could say my favourite games to play on Gentoo were the Portage package manager and nano. Yes, I used it on my gaming PC.
For a while, maybe… But the two distinctions I’d want to make is that, one, that’s also mostly the time you’ll spend learning what you need to set up as part of your system, and two, things that might be out of your control on many distros. I’d also say that by calling it a “meme distro” you’re lumping it together with Hannah Montana Linux and similar.
I will certainly say, however, that I’m rather annoyed by all the people saying “Bro you can set up arch in a few minutes just run archinstal it’s easy”… Not only do I not believe it’s that easy when you don’t know what you’re doing and need to actually use the system, but that also seems to run counter to the point of arch. I think there’s at least two popular arch derivatives meant to remove the enthusiast aspect and provide a streamlined experience, so why recommend arch to new people if not as a learning experience?
The only thing that makes Arch harder to install than Debian is that you have to type “arch install” and hit enter instead of clicking on “install” using a mouse cursor.
It ain’t 2012 anymore.
A distro is way more than just package managers, it’s also the level of testing before deployment, and a shitload of configuration and design decisions.
That said, everything from one distro can generally be configured to work like it does in another distro, but it’s not always easy.
If you want to try Linux, jump right into it, if there’s something you don’t like, maybe another Distro or DE has fixed that exact thing, and it’s easy to swap.
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Ya, also you can just check them out on a “live” thumbdrive, say put Linux mint or whatever distro on a thumbdrive, boot from it and see if you like it. If you don’t, just remove the thumbdrive and reboot, no harm done.
Don’t tell people to stay away from Arch. It is not a god damned meme OS, hell even the Steam Deck production OS is built on Arch.
It’s installer is as easy to use as the other shit you recommended if you can fucking read and follow directions, but skips the unnecessary installer UIs that hand-hold (which requires just as much reading and direction following, difference is the others have a toddler-appealing colorful UI).
If old MAGA Boomers can handle text terminal DOS installs with floppy disks, a contepmorary dumbfuck Windows user will be fine too.
the Steam Deck production OS is built on Arch.
The problem with Arch is that it’s too minimal for someone who comes with an expectation that everything “just works”.
It’s installer is as easy to use as the other shit you recommended if you can fucking read and follow directions, but skips the unnecessary installer UIs that hand-hold (which requires just as much reading and direction following, difference is the others have a toddler-appealing colorful UI).
Most people who use computers today started using GUI software as their first contact with computer tech in general. Hand-holding is customer service, some people need to be guided through the process, and having something that looks like it should work even if you don’t know what you’re doing helps.
If old MAGA Boomers can handle text terminal DOS installs with floppy disks, a contepmorary dumbfuck Windows user will be fine too.
On the one hand, take 10 randos who have never seen anything but Windows, and give half an Arch installer, the other half eg. Fedora. Take a guess which half will fare better.
On the other hand, Linux and OSS in general is about choice. Not just your choice, but the choice of “dumbfuck Windows users” as well. If you like Arch, go for it, but most people find it hard to cope with after coming over from commercial interfaces. You do Arch, they do Linux Mint if they feel like it.
I used Gentoo for gaming for 2 straight years. I’m not a complete newbie. I’m still not going to recommend Arch or Gentoo for anyone’s first distro.
There’s a reason most distros come with a set of reasonable defaults. It’s so that you’re not left wondering “how the fuck do I get wifi working from the command line?” before you’re ready to tackle this issue.
Most people also want their computers to just work. They don’t want to fiddle around with it to get it just right.
You make a compelling argument why not to use arch in calling windows users dumbfucks and swearing every 3 words in your reply lol
What’s wrong with swearing?
And full disclosure, I’m a member of the dumbfuck Windows user group to play my PC games in Steam.
Nothing wrong with swearing in general, but you’re using it in a needlessly hostile way
My point is that the arch community in general is very hostile to new and non technical users, I don’t think many would disagree
Also, why still use a windows PC? Unless you play valorant, Fortnite etc proton is 99% there imo, haven’t had a windows machine in a year or so and I very rarely have any issues
I’m a member of the dumbfuck Windows user group
Emphasis mine
Profanity is meant for very strong negative emotion. Using it casually robs it of most of its value.
Profanity is meant for very strong negative emotion.
No it’s exclusively not; this has to be one of the dumbest takes I’ve read here.
And you have no authority to tell other people how to think or speak. Go away. Fuck off to your own echo chamber where reading a specific word doesn’t hurt your feelings.
Linux Mint seems to be one of the most recommended for newcomers.
“Burn” the ISO on an USB drive, boot live from it and give it a try.
I personally recommend Linux Mint. It feels just close enough to Windows to be fairly comfortable to use. Customizing the task bar on Cinnamon still feels weirdly awkward and confusing though.
I don’t use it, but I recommend it to every newcomer and I’ve had great feedback that it’s easy to get started with. There’s a lot of help available online, and almost anything Debian or Ubuntu-related should apply, most of the time.
Once you get a feel for Linux Mint, you can decide where to go from there. But the most important part is to get a usable system first, and Mint makes that really easy, without some of the drawbacks of Ubuntu.
I recommend the Debian edition, but honestly, any of their spins are fine, pick one that looks cool and have at it.
I’m in the exact same boat as you.
After ten hours of research you will have learned that Linux Mint with Cinnamon is the one you’re looking for, for an intro. Widely used, familiar, stable.
Feel free to read a bunch to confirm.
Seconded. Linux Mint is really comfy and intuitive coming off of lifetime of Windows
Yep, same experience for me.
It’s a great intro AND a great one to stick with. It is basically Ubuntu, the most popular distro(which is built on Debian), minus the controversial Canonical stuff, plus some additional conveniences and polish.
If I switched from Mint to Arch it wouldn’t really affect how I use my PC unless it broke functionality. 95% of usage is in terminal, Firefox, or vscode. And that includes browser-based M365 work apps.
The transition is really not difficult. A distribution like Xubuntu (XFCE+Ubuntu) is very easy. Everything should work out of the box.
xubuntu is fine if your box is a potato or if you’re coming from windows vista
Low on resources? My old hardware is interested. Which others would you recommend?
Arch if you know what you’re doing. It’s what I use, but my machine is pretty beefy. I’ve used xubuntu on the mini PC attached to my TV for about 6 years without a hiccup.
how low we’re talking
Tecra R840, Thinkpad T410…
You might be semi-comfortably running linux mint cinnamon on these (assuming 4gb ram) with xfce you’re trading clunkiness and ancient looks for lower memory usage
no idea about the usual suspects, wifi, bt, graphics probably will require tinkering as is tradition
I try to jump on Linux for years, it breaks so often for me I really lost all faith…
Try Debian
Check out Aeon and Fedora Silverblue. I’m installing Aeon on Desktops and MicroOS on Servers. My computer needs to be a reliable tool. Immutable distros make it exactly that.
The last thing I want to do in my free time or during my work day is be forced to fiddle with some poorly documented and/or implemented idiocy on my personal computer because I forgot to cast the correct incantation prior to updating something. I’m not a masochist.
I wouldn’t recommend aeon, a beta Linux distro that doesn’t work for Nvidia GPUs at the moment as someone looking for something stable. Silver Blue is great though
unfortunately it isn’t. I cannot imagine a less welcoming and beginner friendly community. the reason no one uses Linux is because your communities are indecipherable and you all act like everyone is or should be an engineer in computing.
That’s a horribly wrong idea of us that everyone seems to have.
Have you tried Linux Mint Cinnamon? It’s about as beginner-friendly as it gets, has help forums, a dedicated chat built-in for getting help, a welcome screen that walks you through how to do updates/backups/firewall/etc, and works out of the box. I’m an ex-Windows user and I’ve been using Mint for almost a year now with practically no issue.
thank you
I cannot imagine a less welcoming and beginner friendly community
You have very little imagination, then.
Dear Troll, if that were the case askubuntu wouldn’t be a thing.
No, we don’t. When people use words you don’t understand to ask and answer their own questions, the solution is simple - say that you are a newbie and ask your question in your words. Just ask additional questions when you don’t understand something. Politely, and not like “you nerds, nothing works, help me asap”.
EDIT: Who downvoted this? People really expect others to specifically limit their speech to what a random lurker can understand? And think that using words they don’t understand for interactions not involving them makes a community toxic?
I spent much of yesterday getting Debian to work on my old MacBook.
In theory it’s relatively straightforward, but there are so many little niggles and roadblocks that it really sours the experience.
I set up a user account upon install, as it asked me to, but when I tried to do something with sudo it just kept telling me that I wasn’t in the Sudoers group. Mine is the only account on the machine, why isn’t that set up by default? So I searched for a solution, which appears to have a bunch of different ways to do it, but none of them quite worked, or worked first time. The first few solutions involved using the terminal, but in the end it was easier to open the document in the file manager and edit it as a root user. Linux users are hard for using a terminal when they could just open a document in a text editor.
In the end I got everything set up how I wanted, but it probably shouldn’t have taken a whole day of irritation.
Linux users are hard for using a terminal when they could just open a document in a text editor.
This remains my #1 gripe with an annoyingly large bit of the Linux community, though there slowly becoming a smaller and smaller group
CLI is great for some things, but holy shit it’s terrible for all of the uses you people try to shove down it’s fucking throat. A text editor works better when you can scroll through and click around if it’s any bigger than a few lines, my audio mixer is a lot easier to use with click and drag sliders than it was as ASCII text in a terminal, and in what fucking world is “MV file/path/could/be/long/as/shit another/long/as/shit/path” faster than click-drag between the 2 windows I opened to copy the path names in the first place?
Linux users are hard for using a terminal when they could just open a document in a text editor.
The command line is always there and always has the same basic tools, assuming the system is bootable at all. You can’t guarantee that a given system has a working GUI—it may be broken, inaccessable, or never installed. Having some kind of TUI editor installed is usual on non-embedded systems, but you can’t guarantee which one or that it’s fit for purpose (coaching a newbie through a
visession isn’t something anyone wants to do). That means that the generic instructions that get passed around because they’re fit for most systems (regardless of distro or purpose) use the command line tools.So there is method to the madness, but if you’re coming from a “GUI or bust!” OS it can take a while to get used to.
There was a checkmark for adding the user to that group, IIRC.
Searching for a solution using Google is problematic, yes.
I use DDG, but yeah, it can be tough to find answers.
